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Pandemic Intimacies - Shared screen with speaker view
Adam Christianson
27:58
Clap
Thomas Strong
32:03
Key question; How much time/
Thomas Strong
32:23
How many days after lockdown did it start to shift?
Robbie Currie
34:38
Good old fashion Health Promotion and harm-minimisation - well done Marc
ARose
35:07
agree, love these graphics.
Helen Corkin
35:19
Loved the Prepster Social media mesages looking beyone sexual helath
Helen Corkin
36:39
Marc - did you save the insta live? love to see it
Ant Babajee | he/him
36:46
Some brilliant work, Marc. Well done!
Thomas Strong
36:54
THANK YOU
Adam Christianson
36:55
Clap!~
Lewis Clarke
37:00
Great presentation
The Love Tank
37:22
The Insta live is on the Grindr page
Catherine Dodds
37:51
Thanks Marc!
Duncan Turnbull
38:29
Great presentation Marc. Thank you
Thomas Strong
39:27
Bubbling reallly ‘began’ in NZ
Thomas Strong
40:56
Right; is sex ‘essential’/
Catherine Dodds
43:02
As you are talking, Joao, I am thinking about the ways in which many governments have cancelled many rights-based protections for vulnerable adults during the pandemic. For example the current suspension of duties under the Care Act 2014 in the UK to protect vulnerable adults from neglect, abuse and the effects of ill health and addiction.
Helen Corkin
43:29
bubbling in NZ involved more than one household but they had lower infections
Joao Florencio
46:18
Catherine, that is indeed something that also worried me and that raises some serious questions to think about
Thomas Strong
51:38
Helen; New Zealand initially stood out as the exemplar of a putatively more creative and humane approach than that represented by the strict lockdowns seen in Ireland and Britain. But in fact, the New Zealand guidance conjured what could quite possibly be a relatively tiny bubble: ”Your household, the people you live with, is your bubble” (NZ Ministry of Health 2020). And: ”During the strictest phase of lockdown, most New Zealanders’ bubbles were synonymous with their households” (Olmstead 2020)
Gabriel Duckels
52:43
Well said
Ingrid Young
53:15
I’m sorry I didn’t include the network in your introduction John!
Thomas Strong
55:13
I thnk the AIDS allegory is crucial
Thomas Strong
58:35
No.
Thomas Strong
59:00
It’s totally naive and dangerous
Thomas Strong
59:30
Yes, thank you for these questions
Catherine Dodds
59:59
Well said, John...critical questions are essential and should not be interpreted as attack.
Thomas Strong
01:00:09
“the HIV chain is broken” — really?
Ant Babajee | he/him
01:00:26
Some really good food for thought, John. Thank you.
Helen Corkin
01:00:43
Thomas : from kiwis i know there that wasn't necessarily lived reality . Lower population density and a different idea of community perhaps and the jacinda factor of compassionate leadership. as we know in global health , polices and models cant be lifted and picked up out of context. Yet many would rather be in NZ right now.
Maurice Nagington
01:00:50
Can we switch to viewing Charlie, not John?
Maurice Nagington
01:00:59
Cheers
The Love Tank
01:01:11
Thank you John!! Questions should always be asked. A critical friend is a friend indeed
Ingrid Young
01:01:15
Not sure what happened -sorry about that!
Joao Florencio
01:01:16
I think there’s something to be said about the history of those bigger and most established gay and sexual health charities and their relationship with the state, especially around practices of assimilation and homonormativity since the AIDS crisis. Whilst different in different countries, there was historically a blurring of those activist groups and the state itself since the 1980s in the US, UK, and Germany at least
Thomas Strong
01:01:23
Helen: yes absolutely. But it’s interesting to look at the official discoufrse
Helen Corkin
01:01:44
thomas - agreee
Helen Corkin
01:03:23
Joao- very interesting point re balance
John Mercer
01:03:24
Yes Thomas I agree…
Adam Christianson
01:03:41
@joao indeed
Maurice Nagington
01:03:55
PrEP access (for me at least) was easier... Instead of having to battle for an appointment at my clinic, they switched to postal testing and just picking up the meds. It was so much easier and quicker.
Thomas Strong
01:04:10
How much of that pressure was ‘genuine’
The Love Tank
01:04:34
https://prepster.info/sex-and-the-coronavirus/
Catherine Dodds
01:04:49
@joao - a return to Epstein's Impure Science, and also Dennis Altman's work is perhaps useful in terms of what you are suggesting
Thomas Strong
01:04:50
Dude with Stay At Home as screen name is sending you his address and saying come over
The Love Tank
01:04:53
https://prepster.info/covid/
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:06:05
Responding to Joaos’s comment, I think this speaks to the political-economy of health promotion and the ways in which non-governmental organizations are not in fact independent - and ensure their messaging does not challenge the ideology of funding agencies.
The Love Tank
01:06:15
Link to Grindr insta live https://www.instagram.com/tv/CB34tAXHVck/
Joao Florencio
01:06:30
@sharif I would definitely agree with that!
Thomas Strong
01:06:32
I think we say publicly: lockdown included LOTS of sex
Thomas Strong
01:06:40
lots and lots of it
Thomas Strong
01:06:46
there was literally nothing else to do.
John Mercer
01:07:04
But also lots of shaming and virtue signalling
John Mercer
01:07:23
Staying at home as morally vitruous
Thomas Strong
01:07:25
If we start circulating the idea of people kept fucking, we can counter the shaming.
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:07:30
Charlie is totally right - the 3-month discourse and the ‘celebration’ of lockdown only served to re-draw boundaries between ‘good gays’ and ‘bad queers’
Thomas Strong
01:07:46
yes it was the usuall good gays versus bad gays stuff
John Mercer
01:08:08
Totally and all about self policing
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:08:25
Yes, “look at me - aren’t a good self-disciplining person”!
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:08:33
*I
Thomas Strong
01:08:40
The idea that legallly mandated abstinence was a ‘once in a lifetime’ “opportunity” to ‘break the chain’ was… in a word… chilling.
John Mercer
01:08:51
Yes all of that
Thomas Strong
01:09:49
And had the sort of secondary effect of rescripting our response to AIDS. I wanted to read ‘How to Have Promiscuity in an Epidemic’ through a bullhorn in from of 56 Dean Street.
Catherine Dodds
01:09:50
2008 paper by colleague at Sigma, Peter Keogh: How to be a Healthy Homo http://sigmaresearch.org.uk/reports/item/report2001b
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:09:59
I agree with the concept of ‘deplatforming sex’ - I also think we must bear in mind that this is only certain forms of sex
Thomas Strong
01:10:05
*front
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:10:38
@Thomas - I’d have sold tickets to that public reading!
Catherine Dodds
01:10:44
Keogh's paper provides a strong critique of the moralising discourse in much 'health promotion' in the UK during that era...so returning to earlier work will be of value...
Thomas Strong
01:11:12
@Sharif: front row same price as Madame X tour.
Thomas Strong
01:12:37
I notice the slippage to past tense in various places… was this all something that ‘happened’? or is it happening? just beginning?
Mark Lewis
01:13:59
well said Marc
Thomas Strong
01:14:13
thanks marc
John Mercer
01:14:26
Cheers Marc
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:14:28
The Only Fans platform is a really interesting case of how sex gets re-platformised in ways that are more in the interest of digital companies
Thomas Strong
01:14:42
Someone asked me about the question of tense. Is this in the past? Beginning? ‘When’ are we in the pandemic?
John Mercer
01:15:00
Yes Only Fans is getting a lot of bad press from industry performers
Thomas Strong
01:15:57
Yes I agree Kristian
Maurice Nagington
01:16:04
Re OnlyFans etc, some of my friends definitely managed to swap to online work and made similar amounts of money, but they are now starting to see earnings dropping off (one friend told me her earnings had dropped 60% in the past week or so), but her regular work still hasn't started back up.
Thomas Strong
01:16:50
Yes absolutely, Jamie. Sophie Lewis was good on this.
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:17:28
@Thomas - I think this is a really good question because I think it points to the ‘phases’ of the pandemic and how the ‘exceptional crisis’ discourse (which was also used in the 1980s to an extent) is (unsurprisingly) unsustainable and that pandemics almost always outlive that discourse.
Thomas Strong
01:17:38
We defend sex.
The Love Tank
01:17:49
Im good love. Busy, busy
ABHRA SINGHA ROY
01:19:02
Tinder (and other apps) introduced PASSPORT to change location and lurk around/make connection with international people in this quarantined lifestyle. How has this facilitated or normalized virtual sexual acts?
John Mercer
01:19:19
Digital intimacy of course is no solution or alternative by people who don’t have access to tech for any number of reasons… and there’s still a lot of those people
Gavin Brown
01:19:23
The 'when' question is good @thomas - and, from the perspective of those of us in Leicester this week, there's no singular answer to that.
Thomas Strong
01:19:52
‘When’ for me originates in my experience in Dublin. The public basically gave up in May.
Thomas Strong
01:20:15
But this relates to specifici epidemiological circumstances as well.
Thomas Strong
01:20:59
(In Ireland we don’t have very much community transmission at all anywhere.)
John Mercer
01:21:07
I think this moment has exposed all kinds of tensions that were under the surface anyway that have to do with class and money and access
Gavin Brown
01:21:18
very true
Kristian Møller
01:21:20
yes
Chris Ashford
01:21:32
Absolutely @johnMercer
Maurice Nagington
01:21:44
AMEN JAMIE!!!
Adam Christianson
01:21:46
AMEN
Thomas Strong
01:21:52
Yes thank you. The reason this crisis is what it is: killing public healthcare.
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:21:54
PREACH!
The Love Tank
01:22:04
@jamie PREACH!!
John Mercer
01:22:09
YES
Thomas Strong
01:22:11
The slut out in the woods is purely a scapegoat
John Mercer
01:22:13
And YES
Adam Christianson
01:22:16
YAS :P
John Mercer
01:22:48
YES MARC!
Thomas Strong
01:22:51
But that circumstance is not unique to UK — defunding of public services is an experience common to many places.
Jamie Hakim
01:22:59
Agree Thomas
Mike Corral
01:23:52
Hello to everyone! About defunding the Public Health System: In México, PrEP deliver was suspended temporarily to those participating in the current protocol that is running right now, because of the Covid-19 crisis. Did something like this happen in the UK or in other countries in Europe?Because, from my point of view, it shows that if countries have not demonstrated to have strong health systems, PrEP is not gonna work as it should. For me, this argument is reinforced by the fact that we in México haven’t been able to guarantee HIV treatment for people living with HIV. Thanks!
Thomas Strong
01:23:53
Might ‘care’ be implicit? Enabling the vitality that sexuality represents might be innately ‘caring’? perhaps.
Gavin Brown
01:24:09
Absolutely, @Jamie. There is that issue of ignoring pandemic planning guidance. But there's probably an interesting piece of work to do to look at whether sex and sexuality is mentioned at all in global pandemic planning guidelines from WHO, World Bank etc.
Catherine Dodds
01:24:15
nice one, Marc
Jamie Hakim
01:24:55
That is interesting @Gavin. I have no idea. Need to look into this
Helen Corkin
01:25:21
marathon indeed not a sprint
Tiago Machado Costa
01:26:55
I was wondering if you could comment on how Jamie's comments on the lack of physicality and community in lockdown times can be a first step towards understanding the everyday of gay men in non-urban spaces. In smaller UK cities, those bars, parties, clubs, etc may not exist even in "normal" times, which make these exceptional impacts of pandemic times an "normal" circumstance for a lot of gay men out there.
Gavin Brown
01:28:03
I was going to ask exactly the same as Tiago
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:28:25
@Tiago - I’d definitely suggest checking out the work of Paul Driscoll-Evans on rural gay men.
Michael Rasell
01:28:27
That's an excellent question!!!
Helen Corkin
01:29:16
yes were not and have never been heterogeneous, all too often gay men reads as white gay middle class men
Thomas Strong
01:29:18
Yes. ‘Official Discourse” in Ireland was entirely for and about nuclear middle class households.
Michael Rasell
01:29:54
Can I ask the panel - what are their recommendations for providing intimacy to queer people in the COVID situation, whether in terms of supporting sex or alternative ways?
Thomas Strong
01:30:02
And it was profoundly and dangerously ignorant of the actual living conditions of working people, migrants, queers, poly- folk, and others.
Thomas Strong
01:30:48
Even 4G
Tiago Machado Costa
01:31:32
Hadn't come across that @Sharif, thank you!
Hannah
01:32:07
I'm also interested in how urban spaces have shifted and what effect this has had. Areas which were previously fairly private public spaces suddenly became much busier. For example, the canals and parks in Birminghag had some previously fairly empty crusing spots, but during lockdown were suddenly full of more bored teenagers, families with dogs etc. Also more police presence. How does this sort of changing geography get communicated?
Gavin Brown
01:32:35
But that's the point, @Joap some of the infrastructures of gay life are more sparse in mid-sized regional cities, let alone smaller towns and rural areas, but they are not absent. However, I do think scale and population density does alter how apps etc function
Thomas Strong
01:32:36
Best part of lockdown for me Hannah: no cars on the streets!
Helen Corkin
01:32:48
no
Thomas Strong
01:33:41
Sexual health services in the ROI were mainly completely shut down.
Joao Florencio
01:33:46
@hannnah that’s a really interesting point to think about
Andrew Leavitt
01:33:46
Ireland’s national PrEP programme had only begun to get underway and was largely suspended, at least in terms of the clinical services. Some clinics were providing prescriptions (which could still be filled at community pharmacies for free under the programme) but no testing was done.
Thomas Strong
01:33:57
(Thank you andrew)
Andrew Leavitt
01:35:23
Many who had hoped to begin PrEP were unable to do so. One clinic has just begun enrolling new patients this week, and another has begun to see already-enrolled patients. The main clinic serving gay and bisexual men has yet to re-open.
John Mercer
01:35:29
Me and Jamie are involved in a grant bid to do some work on that kind of moralising
Helen Corkin
01:35:37
please can you out your microphone on to your mouth
Helen Corkin
01:35:43
put
Thomas Strong
01:35:51
follow Julie Marcus !
Thomas Strong
01:35:55
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/quarantine-fatigue-real-and-shaming-people-wont-help/611482/
Lewis Clarke
01:36:07
Thanks Thomas!
Jamie Hakim
01:37:29
Completely agree Catherine!!
Thomas Strong
01:37:38
I think many discussion of COVID in the gay male community become allegories of HIV — inevitably. so what is ‘reckless’ now resignifies what was ‘reckless’ then… and I think this is partly due to a failure of historical imagination
STEFANIE DUGUAY
01:37:47
David Myles, Chris Dietzel and I have been looking at hook-up app discourses about COVID - we’ve (of course) found that hetero apps like Tinder focus on abstinence as a means for romance and establishing long-term monogamous relationships. The biopolitical/moralizing messages from queer apps are more diverse but still very much a “distancing is sexy” theme - more analysis to come.
Kristian Møller
01:38:03
For classic texts: Berlant L and Warner M (1998) Sex in Public. Critical Inquiry 24(2): 547–566.
Thomas Strong
01:38:25
What do Gay Men Want? — Halperin — Key theorization.
Lewis Clarke
01:38:45
I’ve got to go but if anyone has more resources relating to that moralising question you can find me @ClarkeJLewis on Twitter. Thanks all x
Kristian Møller
01:38:57
and Gayle Rubins “Thinking sex: Notes for a radical theory of the politics of sexuality”
Thomas Strong
01:39:13
On moralising: all those motherfuckers were hooking up too. Either that or they just don’t like sex.
Adam Christianson
01:39:18
It seems from the chat if we are unmuted maybe we might chat a bit louder
Thomas Strong
01:39:46
So the moralising is the usual thing: the good gays trying to disciipline the bad gays
Thomas Strong
01:40:07
(whilst organising sex parties in their well-equipped dungeons)
H. Bao
01:40:15
Do we only understand intimacy in human-centred and embodied forms? Is it possible, or even productive, to understand intimacy in non-human, collective forms? (e.g. human-machine intimacy, human-sex toy intimacy etc.)
Thomas Strong
01:41:16
Sorry, I’m chatty cathy at the moment: ‘Intimacy’ in English carries so much positive connotation. As does ‘care.’ To make these concepts do more work, we have to divest them of the implicit ‘positive affect’ they connote.
Gavin Brown
01:41:18
Great question
Thomas Strong
01:42:23
Intimacy is like ‘closeness’: to be ‘close’ is to be ‘caring’. These metaphors for sociality in English are the subject of Marilyn Strathern’s most recent book, Relations. (Incidentally)
Sharif Mowlabocus
01:42:24
Not so much a question but I’m seeing gay men in NYC who’ve had Covid, expressing a certain sense of freedom - of having passed over the threshold. This feels very similar to how some HIV positive folk have previously discussed the ‘freedom’ of no longer having to worry about infection. While I am ambivalent about the HIV/Covid Pandemic comparison, there does seem to be some ‘borrowed knowledge’ or borrowed ideas coming through here.
Thomas Strong
01:43:14
Sharif: yes I was just chatting about this.
Liam
01:43:47
There are examples of sexual subcultures who have still managed to operate and adapted in Zoom environments, successfully and continually. The SF Queernight Fund have hosted Zoom events to raise money for their local scene: https://sfqueernightlifefund.org/
H. Bao
01:43:57
Should this panel be named 'Pandemic Intimacies: gay men and intimacy in the time of coronavirus IN EUROPE?' since all the speakers are addressing the UK and European context?
John Mercer
01:45:11
Yes I think that’s an accurate reflection
Liam
01:46:38
Which potentially links with the guidelines changing to allow for "social bubbles"
Thomas Strong
01:47:13
I agree with H Bao: some comparative perspective would strengthen the already excellent discussion
Thomas Strong
01:47:38
Particularly: What happens in Hong Kong?
Thomas Strong
01:47:42
(as an example)
STEFANIE DUGUAY
01:47:50
I’ve also been interested in queer dance parties during quarantine (not sex parties but likely leading to hookups?) like the Canadian-founded Club Quarantine. Broad question: How can we connect after this event to stay up-to-date on each other’s research?
Thomas Strong
01:47:58
it would really throw into stark contract the peculiarness of UK response
John Mercer
01:48:08
This is something that we could do again with a differently constituted panel
John Mercer
01:49:00
Stef I think Ingrid will have an email list as it was by invite
STEFANIE DUGUAY
01:49:16
Great :)
Thomas Strong
01:49:22
UK: but not a lot from Belfast. ;-)
Naimish Keswani
01:50:07
Or Wales :P
Catherine Dodds
01:50:21
Tremendous job done by Ingrid, Jamie and all panellists. It's been thought-provoking, at a time when perhaps more of us have a bit more brain room for thinking these days???
Kristian Møller
01:50:25
@Stef def intersting! could the organisers maybe collect and share twitter handles?
Thomas Strong
01:50:42
Isn’t there going to be a conference about masculinity and sex coming up in the uk?
Thomas Strong
01:50:47
;-)
Thomas Strong
01:51:41
many of us follow each other already
Gabriel Duckels
01:52:04
I would be super keen for a mailing list
Thomas Strong
01:52:18
I was referring to Joao’s conference
Adam Christianson
01:52:19
Community of pandemic folk? Into it tho
Helen Corkin
01:52:36
mailing list -yes
Tope Fisayo
01:52:42
pandemic intimacy webinar *stans
H. Bao
01:52:48
Sounds great. Looking forward to future events!
Joao Florencio
01:53:28
Oh yes, my upcoming Zoom conference: http://porousmasculinities.exeter.ac.uk/conference :)
Helen Corkin
01:53:50
alvero - i hope so
Robbie Currie
01:53:50
Excellent webinar - agree with Catherine; great for some of us to have an opportunity to think a bit more broadly these days- thank you
Thomas Strong
01:53:59
Yes. For example: This is a great opportunity to learn about masturbation! Something we heard a fair bit about. lol
Chase Ledin
01:54:13
Superb reflections and presentations; many thanks!
Thomas Strong
01:54:20
I have a question
John Mercer
01:54:59
There is Joao’s event and also a Mascnet event that we have a CFP for here https://mascnet.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/BARCA-CFP-v3.pdf
John Mercer
01:55:10
The date will be moved to 2021 though
Thomas Strong
01:55:13
Question: What observations does the panel have regarding ‘digital risk’ as a concept or term in the discourse? So you’ll have a medical doctor saying, try camming!, but be careful you never know where your phone could end up!
Thomas Strong
01:55:37
So with ‘digital intimacy’ comes ‘digital risk’ — but the people who counsel us about this are… doctors.
Roger Newbrook
01:56:08
I'm having connection issues so am going to sign off, thank you everyone for a really interesting afternoon.
Helen Corkin
01:56:24
its a great chance to look at health ans structural inequalities, i hope its taken up.
Helen Corkin
01:56:40
go on Marc!
Helen Corkin
01:57:49
im an optimistic cynic i agree it could go either way
Thomas Strong
01:57:55
I was astonished at how avidly people wanted to police each other.
Gabriel Duckels
01:58:01
Very well said Charlie
Gabriel Duckels
01:58:20
Drug users, people in recovery…
Helen Corkin
01:58:28
like charlie i have concerns. theres been push bac on the move to all online from medics and other PH people
Thomas Strong
01:58:31
yes totally charlie
Catherine Dodds
01:58:54
Agree Charlie. 'Public health' has entirely neglected its roots in structural determinants of health.
Thomas Strong
01:58:58
Our services in Dublin were impacted.
Helen Corkin
01:59:12
HIv services have moved a lot on line but theyre still seeing people who need to be in person
Thomas Strong
01:59:15
yes exactly that happened to me charlies
Helen Corkin
01:59:30
it was more about the wider NHS challenges that impacted SH
Ant Babajee | he/him
01:59:40
Definitely postponing appointments - my bloods next week are just a phone discussion instead and bloods only if necessary
Gavin Brown
01:59:42
so, then how do we shift the political debate and campaigning away from the 'equalities' agenda and towards addressing more material and systemic inequalities and their intersections?
Kostana Banjac
01:59:43
correct re: annual review
Adam Christianson
02:01:36
Thanks so much folk for the good talks!
Mary
02:01:44
Thanks for great talks!
Ant Babajee | he/him
02:01:45
A great discussion and presentation. Thank you so much all!
Maurice Nagington
02:01:48
Thanks for hosting the event, really inreresting
Sharif Mowlabocus
02:01:53
Thanks to everyone who organized this - and for the great conversation and idea sharing. It has been inspiring.
H. Bao
02:01:53
Thank all for this great panel!
Helen Corkin
02:01:57
very useful and interesting thank you all
Debra Ferreday
02:01:58
Thanks all for amazing talks and discussion!
STEFANIE DUGUAY
02:01:58
Thanks, fantastic panel!
Giuseppe Capalbo
02:02:04
Thank you! Inspiring panel
Naimish Keswani
02:02:05
Thanks so much!
Kazuki Yamada
02:02:07
Thank you for this wonderful discussion!
Thomas Strong
02:02:07
A very important panel.
Gabriel Duckels
02:02:09
Yes, thank you so much for arranging this.
Hannah
02:02:10
Thanks everyone, great talks and geat questions!
Adam Christianson
02:02:10
Hope to hear from you all soon!!
Maurice Nagington
02:02:11
So many people I wasn to hug!!!
Kristian Møller
02:02:13
This was so interesting, thanks everyone for the chat, and thanks to the organisers for pulling it together!
Alex
02:02:13
This was so great! Thanks everyone
Thomas Strong
02:02:18
We have to insist on keeping sex in public view.
Robbie Currie
02:02:20
Great, thanks everyone
Gavin Brown
02:02:20
really great event. thanks to the panel, to Ingrid for chairing,, but also great discussions in the chat
Sam Miles
02:02:21
Thank you for the fantastic panel! And for chairing, Ingrid.
Lesley Gabriel
02:02:22
Brilliant panel and chat, thank you so much all!!
Thomas Strong
02:02:24
That in itself is a political act.
The Love Tank
02:02:27
Great conversation. Thanks everyone. Please follow me @marct_01
Adam Christianson
02:02:31
Yes thanks Ingrid
Jamie Hakim
02:02:40
Thanks everyone for coming, and thanks to the panellists. It’s been an absolute pleasure!
Sharif Mowlabocus
02:02:41
Great hosting Ingrid!!!
Jamie Hakim
02:02:50
And thanks for Ingrid for doing such a fab job!
Clarissa Smith
02:02:53
Thanks very much, great discussion
mollymerryman
02:03:02
thank you!
Alexander Maine
02:03:02
Thanks, great discussion
Chris Ashford
02:03:07
Thanks everyone!
Mike Corral
02:03:07
Muchas gracias, saludos a todxs!
Frankie Fei
02:03:07
Cheers everyone. Such an important conference.